Show Notes
Bob Jonkman talks with Tamara Lorincz and Peter Eglin about the role of universities in taking a moral stand on world events. We also announce a few initiatives for Peace Week.
The interview starts at 4m00s.
Online:
- Voice of Women for Peace: https://vowpeace.org/
- Draw The Line: https://drawtheline.world/
- Canadian Foreign Policy Institute (CFPI): https://www.foreignpolicy.ca/
- Toronto Association for Peace and Solidarity (PeaceTO): https://www.peaceto.ca/
Upcoming Events
-
This event has been cancelled. For more information see Wilfrid Laurier University cancels talk on Canada and the Genocide in Gaza from ActionNetwork.org.
- What: Public Event: Canada and the Genocide in Gaza
- When: 7:00pm to 9:00pm on Friday 19 September 2025
- Where: Room 106, Schlegel Building, Wilfid Laurier University
- Location: 75 University Avenue, Waterloo, Ontario Map
- Contact: Tamara Lorincz tlorincz@dal.ca
- What: Public Event: Canada and the Genocide in Gaza
-
- What: National Day of Action: Draw The Line – Waterloo
- When: 2:00pm to 3:00pm on Saturday 20 September 2025
- Where: Waterloo Public Square
- Location: 75 King Street South Map
- Online: https://drawtheline.world
- What: National Day of Action: Draw The Line – Waterloo
Podcast
Download: ckms-community-connections-2025-09-15-episode218-Tamara-Lorincz-and-Peter-Eglin.mp3 (52 MB, 56m34s, episode 218)
Index
| Time | Title | Album | Artist |
|---|---|---|---|
| 0m00s | Theme for CKMS Community Connections ccc |
 CKMS Community Connections |
Steve Todd |
| 0m55s | Enclosure |
 Incarceration (single) |
Retrograth |
| 4m00s | Dr. Peter Eglin, Professor Emeritus of Sociology at Wilfrid Laurier University explains what Sociology is: It’s the interrogation of social life; what makes it possible for people to live together? The problem of social order, why doesn’t it all fall apart? What makes society work? Peter is concerned with climate breakdown, the political stuff that’s happening in the United States and affecting us in Canada. One of the problems with climate breakdown is that people who are most affected, in the global south, are least responsible for it. | ||
| 6m30s | Peter and Yves Engler have an upcoming lecture, speaking on Canada and the genocide in Gaza. It’s a free event, no registration required. Peter has known Yves for over 15 years; Peter was teaching a course for which he didn’t have a textbook, and Yves had just written one that was exactly what Peter needed. Peter invited Yves to talk to his class, several times, and they became friends. Tamara has known Yves even longer than Peter has. They’ve worked together on several conflicts: Gaza, Haiti, Canada’s role in Iraq and Afghanistan. They’ve worked on getting Canada to have a foreign policy premised on peace, international law, justice, sustainable development. Tamara and Yves came together to prevent Canada from getting a seat on the UN Security Council; Canada’s record on foreign policy has been egregious, and doesn’t deserve a seat. From there they launched the Canadian Foreign Policy Iniative (CFPI) which is sponsoring the event on Friday. | ||
| 12m00s | Peter and Yves will talk about their new books: Yves has written “Canada: Building Apartheid with Israel”; Peter has written “Analyzing the Israeli Effect in Canada”. It’s an account of episodes in Peter’s experience with the media and at Wilfrid Laurier University. It recounts Peter’s own encounters trying to get recognition from the ‘intellectual class’ in Canada. Media and the University both support Israel heavily. Peter tells us of the different reportage for victims from Israel than from victims from Palestine. Peter also tells of the lack of response by WLU on the bombing of Gaza University. Peter had tenure, so his career was not in jeopardy from his outspoken views. But an article he wrote on the Palestinian issue in 2001 in response to an article by his colleague Barry Kay (written from a Zionist position); Peter’s article was removed, but not Barry’s. The target of Peter’s book is fellow intellectuals, what they have failed to do in response to what Israel has done to Palestine. | ||
| 20m00s | Tamara is a student at the Balsilie School of International Affairs, an institution that should be discussion the topic of the situation in Palestine, and how Canada should be helping to end the injustice, ending the genocide, ending the disposession — Canada has a history of committing the same injustices against Indigenous people. But there has been a suppression of dialogue about Palestine. There is no serious talk about Canada’s role in Ukraine, in arming Taiwan against China, how Canada is fuelling and fomenting conflict in the world. Tamara is troubled by the state of universities, not welcoming diversity of opionion, peace, justice, and sustainable development. Neither WLU nor the University of Waterloo has made a statement on the genocide or the starvation of Palestine by Israel. We need to reflect on the role of universities in society. | ||
| 24m30s | Bob asks that since the University has not acknowledged these international affairs, how much can Tamara trust the program she’s in? Tamara is worried that the University is duplicating the dominant narrative, that it is not doing research, engaging in dialogue, or critiqueing Canada’s role in these international conflicts. By not acknowledging the problem the universities are perpetuating the problem. Tamara gives several examples of Canada’s participation in violence, but without any accountability. Tamara wants to see more voices and research calling attention to these issues. But students with divergent opinions are being marginalized, shut out, denied research funding, and not getting positions at the university. Tamara is a long time peace and environmental justice activist. There have been complaints against her, but she relies on solid, evidence-based analysis to give her the confidence to articulate her views. Tamara notes that there is no Canada Research Chair in peace studies. | ||
| 29m00s | Bob points out that it’s not just the Department of International Affairs or the Department of Sociology, this anti-peace, pro-violence view extends to Physics and Engineering. Tamara says that the University of Waterloo is training its students to produce weapons that bomb, kill, injure, maim, and destroy the people in Gaza. Why are there no seminars to respond to the report “Exposing Canadian Military Exports to Israel” that shows that Canada is sending weapons to Israel that are used to kill Palestinians during the genocide. | ||
| 31m00s | Bob brings up the increase in NATO spending, will this be used to enhance university spending on these programs to develop weapons? Tamara says “No doubt”, but we do not yet have the details on Canada’s military spending, which will come out with the federal budget in the fall. In the past 10 years Canadian military spending increased 100%, about half of which went to universities. But there is no funding for peace research. Canada spends $41 billion a year on military spending; in the next decade military spending will increase to $150 billion a year. Prime Minister Mark Carney has said this will mean cuts to social and environmental programs. There will be cuts to pensions, housing, health care, and education. | ||
| 33m30s | Bob thinks that a Department of Sociology is the closest thing a univerity would have to a Department of Peace. Peter has been taken with the question of what is appropriate for a university to do in response to events. Universities are supposed to be above party politics. Peter has written about two kinds of politics, one to do with human rights, like the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, which Peter calls Politics One. The party politics is Politics Two. Politics One is something the parties themselves are subjected to, and so supersedes Politics Two. Peter says that the University’s mission statements are full of humane statements, but when it comes to the injustice of Israel and Palestine one cannot justify not commenting when a university in Gaza is attacked. The corporate media is beholden to the corporate sector, and journalists know where their bread is buttered. | ||
| 37m00s | Tamara says a university is a different institution from journalism. A university is supposed to welcome and encourage evidence-based analysis, have dialogue and debate on the issues that are taking place in the world, encourage diversity of opinion, and then using the principles and values the university articulates to come to a greater understanding of what’s going on, and then helping our governement and society take good and appropriate action. But Tamara doesn’t see that happening. There is so much destruction in Gaza, and the universities’ failure to speak out is troubling. The double standards that we see in the universities’ and government is responding to what is happening in Palestine and how it’s treating Israel, then comparing that to what is happening in Ukraine and how it’s treating Russia. Tamara gives the example of the Russian drones flying over Poland’s airspace, how the government reacted, calling in diplomats, treating this as a huge diplomatic incident with a lot of condemnation, censure, and media attention; compared to what has happened in Gaza: more bombing of civilians, Palestinians are starving to death, but there has been no comment from our government. | ||
| 41m00s | Coming up on 21 September is the International Day of Peace, followed by the National Day for Truth and Reconciliation on 30 September, and the International Day of Nonviolence on 2 October. This is Peace Week or IDOPAN, the International Days of Peace and Nonviolence, as WR Nonviolence used to call it. | ||
| 41m30s | Peter takes a moment to quote Niko Block: “We have seen far more of this genocide than any other while it was ongoing, and I believe the combination of its visibility and longevity marks it as one of the greatest moral failures in the history of humanity. Never before have we seen this level of international complicity in manifest war crimes.” Peter is moved by the scale of this genocide, the enormity of getting away with it, that it has gone on for two years. | ||
| 42m30s | Tamara says we need to act more on this, and they are having these two events in recognition of Peace Week. The first, “What Rules-Based Order? Canada and the Genocide in Gaza” lecture on 19 September 2025 at WLU, then an action at the Waterloo Public Square, “Draw The Line”, in solidarity with a number of other organizations. There are five demands: 1) Put people over corporate profits, fund our families and communities; 2) Refuse ongoing colonialism, uphold Indigeneous sovereignty; 3) Stop blaming migrants, demand full immigration status for all now; 4) End the war machine, stand for justice and peace, cut military spending; and 5) End the era of fossil fuels, protect Mother Earth. | ||
| 45m00s | On the Draw The Line announcement Bob sees the logos for Canadian Voice of Women for Peace and Women’s International League for Peace & Freedom. Tamara is a member of both organizations, and gives some of their history. Their intent is to prevent another global war. Tamara gives examples of the importance of peace efforts. | ||
| 48m00s | Bob comments that we need better political leadership to advocate for peace. Peter points out that Yves Engler would be a good leader for the federal NDP, his platform aligns with all these values. He also advances degrowth; to effective handle climate breakdown we need to stop the economic growth we seem to think must be driven along at any cost. Peter says it will be inspiring to be on stage with Yves. His speaking engagements are partially a leadership campaign tour. Tamara says we do need better leadership to ensure a good future for our children. Peter comments on the youth unemployment rate; Tamara gives examples of the poverty in Canada. This is the reason for ending military spending, that funding needs to be invested in young people, green jobs, community resilience, health care, education. | ||
| 53m00s | Tamara gives a quick review of her upcoming activities, including a speech she’s giving at Peace Toronto, “A Peace of the Pie: People’s Hearing on Military Spending” on 21 September 2025. Peter will be a delegate for the Kitchener NDP riding association in Niagara Falls this weekend. Peter gives a quick plug for Debbie Chapman’s definition for affordable housing. | ||
| 55m00s | Bob gives the end credits. | ||
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Bonus Video
Video: CKMS Community Connections for Monday 15 September 2025 (YouTube)
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